Windows Misting Up

[Guest Phil D]

My Galaxy mists up about 2 minutes after setting off. This has only started happening, although i only bought it in March last year and it did it a little then until the good weathe arrived. Their doesn't appear to be water in the foot wells, and the aircon never worked all summer, so it's unlikely to be that. Any ideas, is it common, how can i stop it? HELP!!!

[Denis]

Phil, do you mean your A/C doesn't work? If so, I wouldn't be surprised that you are having problems. My Galaxy mists all winter unless I make constant use of the A/C and quickclear windscreen.

[Ivor_E_Tower]

Is your air ricirculation flap sticking so that no fresh air is getting into the car? Try leaving the engine off, turning key to position II and operating the recirc button. If no noise, it's almost certainly stuck (and probably in the recirc position too).

[william]

misting should not occur if there is enough fresh air coming in to the cabin and if the air is warm enough.

 

dennis, there shouldn't be any need to run the air con and quickclear heated screen to constantly keep the screen clear, maybe your recirculation flap is stuck as well. if you do use the air con, when you switch it off the screen will mist up until all the condensate has been clear from the coil, so you have to use it all the time.

[Dave-G]

You omitted details of your motor..my "r" reg seat misted up regularly in wet weather when i picked up damp passengers...till i ripped out the pollen filter, there was then enough air inlet to clear the screen,and keep it clear. My post 2k gal dont have that problem as it has a more powerfull inlet fan,and quickclear screen.

[Guest paulxxxxx]

I have same problem on a P-reg..... suddenly all windows started misting, and using the blower only made it worse (my a/c's not been working for few months). The recirc switch light is working normally when I press the button, but there's a complete absence of the usual clanks and whirrs which I expect as recirc cuts in.

 

Looks like it's stuck in recirculate mode.

 

So this leads me to think that either the recirc flap motor actuator is bust, or a relay has gone, or just possibly the flap is stuck (tho I've listened very carefully and can't hear even the slightest click or buzz, as of struggling motors....)

 

So where do I go from here? Anyone know where the relevant relay or actuator is, and how does one get to it? Any help appreciated.

[Ivor_E_Tower]

Time to get the TIS CD out I fear.

Listening to my Gal, I have a feeling that the air control defaults to recirculate, and only "opens" to outside air after a minute or so from starting up. If you get interior misting, I think that it must almost certainly be due to the flap sticking in the default recirc position. If this is the case, and you can find it after dashboard dismantling or whatever, then either the actuator will need replacing, or you wedge the flap in the non-recirc position - which is something you could try first, just to see if the misting stops.

[_dg]

I too have this problem. I think its a common thing and there are other threads about it.

 

I experience this in the summer too.

 

Apart from the stuck recirculation flap possibility, I would go for the inherant design fault of the air-con whereby a small amount of moisture is left in the system which then gets blown into the car.

 

Its a catch-22 situation, the more you use it, the more you have to use it.

[suzuki91]

i have misty windows on my 97 tdi, used the air con whenever i needed it during the warmer weather.

have to keep switching it on to clear the mist from the windscreen and keep turning the control from cabin to windscreen to get passengers warm.

then i get cold feet!!!!

my old serria had a good vent system, even kept all warm and de-misted on just air flow with out the fan on.

it would be nice to have hot air blow from all the vents at the same time.

by the way how do you remove the pollen filter, may try that?

:(

[Taliska]

This is wierd...

 

Mine's a new 93 TDI Galaxy and it seems to mist up a lot too.

 

When raining I seem to have to have the blower on the screen to keep it clear most of the time.

 

Today (yes, the day that it seemed to rain like mad) the windscreen was completely soaked when I got in this evening to go home. I was really surprised when the windscreen wipers didn't clear it, as I thought it was on the outside at first! Funny though, it was only the windscreen that was affected and none of the others.

 

I generally run with the a/c off as it's winter(ish) and I don't really need it... unless of course I should be using it because of the condensation!

 

Hummm...

 

Taliska

[Ivor_E_Tower]

Yes - funny weather today. Mine was all misted up on the inside too, don't know where the water comes from because I run with aircon on all the time to keep the inside dry!

One thing to check is that you keep the inside of the windscreen clean - particularly on a new car, the emulsifiers(?) in the plastics outgas and deposit themselves on the glass, causing a film which encourages the mist, and makes a horrible smear when you try to clear it too!

[asimons]

My 03 Galaxy also had the wet-screen syndrome on the recent wet days. Took longer than I expected for the heated screen and aircon to dry it off too - but then the humidity outside was close to 100% and inside wasn't much better as I'd got soaked walking (swimming?) to the car.

 

I've also recently (i.e. in the cooler nights that we've had) encountered misting of the glass when running without aircon - worse on the side windows than the windscreen - mainly with 4 people in the car. Seems you need the aircon even though the air outside is dry. As far as I can tell, the recirc flap is behaving - at least, turning recirc on and off makes a difference to the noises.

 

It was all so much simpler when it was hot and there was no question you needed the aircon on al the time!!

 

Aid

[Tigger]

Some have said why have a sunroof with AC? I had a sunroof on my old galaxy and found it invaluble on a cold frosty morning with the heating on full lovely warm feet with cooler air around the head. It also helped clear the mist very quickly, and I found that it helped pull more air through the car clearing windows. Thats why it was on the spec when I changed to this new car. Even if I had not found one with a sunroof I would have had one put in! Sorry for all those that say if you have AC you don't need a sunroof!

[Guest paulxxxxx]

Would seem the Galaxy ventilation is on the limits, even when it's working correctly.........

 

Regarding my own ventilation problem (definitely stuck on Recirc), anyone got any idea where to start on getting at the actuator/relay? Someone mentioned a TIS CD, but I don't have any idea what this is.

 

Is it inevitable that I'm going to have to remove the dashboard (be afraid, be very afraid..) or is there a possbility that I can reach up under the dash?

 

For the record, it's a P-reg V6.

[Guest yurir]

Is it inevitable that I'm going to have to remove the dashboard (be afraid, be very afraid..) or is there a possbility that I can reach up under the dash?

 

If it's just a relay or fuse problem, then you could solve quite easily, if someone with a TIS (Ford Technical Information Service) CD-ROM can give you the wiring diagram.

 

If it's the actuator, wiring, or flap, then the dash needs to come out, as the flap is buried behind, close to the bulk head. Removing the dash is a major task, that could easily take a day, and another to refit; never mind to solve the problem. So if you've anything else that needs doing behind the dash, that would be a good time make a list.

[gazza007]

I've noted rather more than unusual misting up recently, I think it's just down to a large glass area and with the sun pouring through and then getting a rapid cooling late in the day.

I am a little concerned that my Air-con may still be duff as it isn't clearing too quickly but from what I remember it won't kick in if the temp is below 5 degs.

Will wait till the weather warms up to prove it, then I'll go back to SEAT again!!

[Guest paulxxxxx]

Thanks Yuri...

 

Any kind person got the TIS CD and could find me the relevant bit? I think I just have to hope it's the relay/fuse.. the thought of getting the dash out, or paying a dealer to do it, is horrific. The question becomes WHERE are the relay/fuse for the actuator flap (there's nothing relevant identified either in the Haynes maual diagram, or on the Galaxy fuse panel cover).

 

paul@orca.freeserve.co.uk

[seatkid]

Thanks Yuri... 

 

Any kind person got the TIS CD and could find me the relevant bit? I think I just have to hope it's the relay/fuse.. the thought of getting the dash out, or paying a dealer to do it, is horrific. The question becomes WHERE are the relay/fuse for the actuator flap (there's nothing relevant identified either in the Haynes maual diagram, or on the Galaxy fuse panel cover).

 

paul@orca.freeserve.co.uk

Ahh...Misting problems - possibly the tip of a very nasty iceberg, certainly a bag of worms..

 

On vehicles without climate control:

 

The recirc control controls a vacuum pipe which goes via an electric cutoff valve before it operates the flap (by vacuum). Check by starting engine, turn on blower on medium to high. When you turn recirc on or off you will hear quite a load thump from the passenger side and a distinct change in tone of the air when it draws in from the passenger footwell.

 

On vehicles with climate control:

 

Don't think there is a fuse/relay for the electrically operated actuator flap - you can check if the actuator flap is working like this. Turn ignition on but dont start engine. Turn on blower on lowish setting. When you turn on or turn off recirc you will hear a mild thump on the passenger side when the flap moves. At higher blower settings the tone of the air will change as it draws air from the passenger footwell.

 

Default position for recirc flap is outside air as it would be dangerous otherwise (lack of oxygen to occupants) and both systems turn recirc off after 20 mins automatically to stop people passing out.

 

Those with no air conditioning must get used to a life of misting up on rainy days.

 

Why does it mist up? This is due to the poor design of the ventilation system. The problem is the pollen filter is located in a stupid place - in a place right where water from the windsceen drains - this results in a wet filter or at best a filter drawing air in over water. To make matters worse the drain valves in the a/c system can get blocked allowing the system to become filled with water. There are numerous Ford TSBs on this and other related a/c problems,

 

so rule no.1 - if your car is in warranty get it in now and insist it is fixed, otherwise....

 

check a/c drain valves and discard if necessary -

 

for cars built prior to 04.99 - fit a revised pollen filter frame (which has a plastic water deflector) - this has to be glued to the pollen filter - also fit an additional foam filter

 

fit a revised blower resistor (which boosts the fan speeds)

 

Now the really nasty bit - if your a/c is packing in or has packed up, not only do your misting problems begin..your love affair with your Shalaxy will probably end...

 

Note 1: the a/c switches off automatically below 5 deg C outside temp to prevent icing up of the evaporator. So at this time of the year the a/c is basically useless. (They could have designed it so the heater came before the evaporator but???)

 

To check aircon is working, with somebody listening under the bonnet and the engine running, (provided it is above 5 deg C ambient), when you turn on the aircon (from econ to auto on the climate control) you should hear the a/c compressor clutch clack loudly and the engine revs will probably dip momentarily.

 

If the output of the a/c is weak and/or the a/c is noisy or making uncharacteristicly strange noises - despite what the dealer might tell you, the refrigerant is low and should be topped up.

 

If it isnt working at all, prepare yourself for a long and expensive process before you get it working again properly (i.e.without any leaks). Note that if any part is changed in the a/c system, the dryer *must* be changed and the a/c lubricant replenished. Seat dealers certainly don't seem to know this simple fact.

 

Sad Fact: There are a number of Ford TSBs regarding faulty/poor quality/failing evaporators (thats the bit in the dash that could be under water..and costs an arm and a leg to replace)

[Dave-G]

Welcom to the site SEATKID,you seem very well informed,and have appeared at a time when another very well informed member has gone noticeably quiet. :angry: He also has a seat,albeit somewhat newer and more powerfull than your's :blink:

 

It's life jim, but not as we know it

[william]

I find the responses to this question of misting up very odd and negative - I don't have any problems.

 

The reasons behind misting are several and not just to "poor" design.

The basic problem is water vapour condensing on a cold windscreen. This water can come from many sources - A/C drains blocked/Evaporator core/water in footwell/from outside/from people in the car!

 

If you run the system on recirc YOU WILL mist up unless you stop breathing. Turning the A/C on (it will run below 5 deg C on manual systems - it has a thermostat in the evaporator core which stops the core from freezing and that stops liquid refrigerant from returning to the compressor) will remove the water from the air but a soon as it is turned off the water vapour on the core will be evapourated off and go back into the air - hence the mist returns (this is most noticable in the mornings when the car is first started after the run home with the A/C on).

(The heater core can never come before the evaporator as the air off the heater can get to 80 deg C which will raise the pressure in the evaporator to above 25 Bar (375 psi) and lead to refrigerant oil migration around the system.)

 

Heat and fresh air are the best way to reduce misting without A/C. Heat raises the ability of the air to hold more water and fresh air removes excess moisture from the car. If you have a water leak this must be resolved before misting problem will be totally removed.

 

Low A/C performance is not always a sign of low gas. At this time of year the output of the system will be lower. The amount of heat that the evaporator can absorb (you can not generate cold, just remove heat) is dependant on temperature differentials, humidity and airflow (remember your O level physics E=mcpT , energy = mass flow rate x specific heat capacity x temperaure difference). So at low ambient temperature the capacity is lower and the outlet temperatures will be about 2-3 deg lower (assuming the heat is off).

 

If you need to fix an A/C system I suggest you go to an A/C service agent not a dealer. They have more experiance/know what they are talking about and will be cheaper.

[Guest SA Intruder]

Dave, you mean moi?

 

I am up to my nuts in a house purchase abroad at the moment, and I have a new potential Project under serious consideration:

 

I have put a bid in for 2 salvage vehicles locally to me. One is a 2001 Passat V6 Tdi Auto, the other a Sharan 115 TDi Auto. The Passat has been rolled but mechanically is mint, low miles. The Sharan has had an engine fire, which has destroyed the engine and box. But the bay and loom is OK, the bonnet is knacked.

 

Can you guess what I'm thinking?

 

It may not come off, my bid was fairly low.

[Dave-G]

"you mean moi"? :o AHA.. .yea...missed the wise cracks and info :D Nah...2.5/150.... it'd have too many 5's in it! ;) All the best in - spain was it? B)

[Guest wolfie]

Would seem the Galaxy ventilation is on the limits, even when it's working correctly.........

 

Regarding my own ventilation problem (definitely stuck on Recirc), anyone got any idea where to start on getting at the actuator/relay? Someone mentioned a TIS CD, but I don't have any idea what this is.

 

Is it inevitable that I'm going to have to remove the dashboard (be afraid, be very afraid..) or is there a possbility that I can reach up under the dash?

 

For the record, it's a P-reg V6.

 

 

the recirc flap is vacuum operated, it maybe that the switch/valve is stuck? remove the switch and see if you can manually operate the flap by sucking/blowing down the hose! if mot remove the upper glove box (if you have one?) and you should be able to see the actuator

 

:D jeez doing a gooner http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/images/smilies/w4nker.gifhere :D

[NikpV]

Would seem the Galaxy ventilation is on the limits, even when it's working correctly.........

 

Regarding my own ventilation problem (definitely stuck on Recirc), anyone got any idea where to start on getting at the actuator/relay? Someone mentioned a TIS CD, but I don't have any idea what this is.

 

Is it inevitable that I'm going to have to remove the dashboard (be afraid, be very afraid..) or is there a possbility that I can reach up under the dash?

 

For the record, it's a P-reg V6.

 

 

the recirc flap is vacuum operated, it maybe that the switch/valve is stuck? remove the switch and see if you can manually operate the flap by sucking/blowing down the hose! if mot remove the upper glove box (if you have one?) and you should be able to see the actuator

 

:D jeez doing a gooner here :D

 

 

:D :D :D :D

[Guest gooner52]

still wating to see the pics of this vr6 :D